Notes from KF
A William Frater has been found in:
Post Office London County Suburbs Directory, 1908. [Part 1: Street, Commercial, & Trades Directories]
Wells Terrace, Finsbury Park (N), [Islington] Fonthill Road, Seven Sisters Road to Stroud Green Road
2. Frater, Wm House decorator
Also on page 471 at 2 Wells Terrace, Finsbury Park, LondonGiven the birth year of William Oliver I have looked up my 1901 indexes. I have only one William FRATER born around 1896 in the 1901 census. This is a transcript from the copy:
57 Eden Grove Islington (within walking distance of other ancestors of KF's FRATER family branch)
District of St. James
William FRATER age 26 House Painter Born in Islington (est. birth year 1875)
Ada FRATER age 25 wife Born in Islington
William FRATER age 4 son Born in Islington
Ada FRATER age 2 daughter Born in IslingtonAccording to the 1881 census there is only one William FRATER born about 1874 and he is this one
1881 Census
Dwelling: 94 Isledon Rd Census Place: Islington, London, Middlesex, England Source: FHL Film 1341056 PRO Ref RG11 Piece 0259 Folio 15 Page 24 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Oliver FRATER M 30 M St Pancras, Middlesex, England Rel: Head Occ: Painter (House) Ellen FRATER M 28 F South Hornsey, Middlesex, England Rel: Wife Ellen FRATER 11 F Islington, Middlesex, England Rel: Dau William FRATER U 6 M Islington, Middlesex, England Rel: Son George FRATER U 4 M Islington, Middlesex, England Rel: Son James FRATER 3 M Islington, Middlesex, England Rel: Son Oliver FRATER 3 m M Islington, Middlesex, England Rel: SonThere was a William Charles born in 1873 but BMD also shows his death in 1873. Is William Charles a son of Oliver & Ellen? Is this William the son of Oliver & Ellen? The names chosen in the children do suggest that this William is probably the son.
Notes from KF
Given the birth year of William Oliver I have looked up my 1901 indexes. I have only one William FRATER born around 1896 in the 1901 census. This is a transcript from the copy:
57 Eden Grove Islington (within walking distance of other ancestors of KF's FRATER family branch)
District of St. James
William FRATER age 26 House Painter Born in Islington (est. birth year 1875)
Ada FRATER age 25 wife Born in Islington
William FRATER age 4 son Born in Islington
Ada FRATER age 2 daughter Born in IslingtonSurname taken from Free BMD marriage pages. Only 1 William & Ada married in Islington in this time frame.
1901 Census
RG 13/251 Page 4
Ecclesiastical St Silas
Municipal Finsbury
Ward No 1 (Pentonville)
Parliamentary Islington South
64 Wynford Road, Clerkenwell
Frederick Purle Head M 56 Bowyer (Toy) London
Caroline Purle Wife M 50 London
Willie Purle Son M 22 Cabinet Maker London
Lilly Purle Saughter S 20 Machinist (Shirt) London
Peter Purle Son S 17 Smith (Blacks) London
Joseph Purle Son S 15 Errand Boy (Port) London
Caroline Purle Daughter S 9 London
Mary Knight Drand-daughter S 4 London
Jane Foord Mother-in-Law W 78 London
Charles Frater Nephew - 18 London
1901 Census
RG 13/251 Page 4
Ecclesiastical St Silas
Municipal Finsbury
Ward No 1 (Pentonville)
Parliamentary Islington South
64 Wynford Road, Clerkenwell
Frederick Purle Head M 56 Bowyer (Toy) London
Caroline Purle Wife M 50 London
Willie Purle Son M 22 Cabinet Maker London
Lilly Purle Saughter S 20 Machinist (Shirt) London
Peter Purle Son S 17 Smith (Blacks) London
Joseph Purle Son S 15 Errand Boy (Port) London
Caroline Purle Daughter S 9 London
Mary Knight Drand-daughter S 4 London
Jane Foord Mother-in-Law W 78 London
Charles Frater Nephew - 18 London
1901 Census
RG 13/251 Page 4
Ecclesiastical St Silas
Municipal Finsbury
Ward No 1 (Pentonville)
Parliamentary Islington South
64 Wynford Road, Clerkenwell
Frederick Purle Head M 56 Bowyer (Toy) London
Caroline Purle Wife M 50 London
Willie Purle Son M 22 Cabinet Maker London
Lilly Purle Saughter S 20 Machinist (Shirt) London
Peter Purle Son S 17 Smith (Blacks) London
Joseph Purle Son S 15 Errand Boy (Port) London
Caroline Purle Daughter S 9 London
Mary Knight Drand-daughter S 4 London
Jane Foord Mother-in-Law W 78 London
Charles Frater Nephew - 18 London
1901 Census
RG 13/251 Page 4
Ecclesiastical St Silas
Municipal Finsbury
Ward No 1 (Pentonville)
Parliamentary Islington South
64 Wynford Road, Clerkenwell
Frederick Purle Head M 56 Bowyer (Toy) London
Caroline Purle Wife M 50 London
Willie Purle Son M 22 Cabinet Maker London
Lilly Purle Saughter S 20 Machinist (Shirt) London
Peter Purle Son S 17 Smith (Blacks) London
Joseph Purle Son S 15 Errand Boy (Port) London
Caroline Purle Daughter S 9 London
Mary Knight Drand-daughter S 4 London
Jane Foord Mother-in-Law W 78 London
Charles Frater Nephew - 18 London
1901 Census
RG 13/251 Page 4
Ecclesiastical St Silas
Municipal Finsbury
Ward No 1 (Pentonville)
Parliamentary Islington South
64 Wynford Road, Clerkenwell
Frederick Purle Head M 56 Bowyer (Toy) London
Caroline Purle Wife M 50 London
Willie Purle Son M 22 Cabinet Maker London
Lilly Purle Saughter S 20 Machinist (Shirt) London
Peter Purle Son S 17 Smith (Blacks) London
Joseph Purle Son S 15 Errand Boy (Port) London
Caroline Purle Daughter S 9 London
Mary Knight Drand-daughter S 4 London
Jane Foord Mother-in-Law W 78 London
Charles Frater Nephew - 18 London
1901 Census
RG 13/251 Page 4
Ecclesiastical St Silas
Municipal Finsbury
Ward No 1 (Pentonville)
Parliamentary Islington South
64 Wynford Road, Clerkenwell
Frederick Purle Head M 56 Bowyer (Toy) London
Caroline Purle Wife M 50 London
Willie Purle Son M 22 Cabinet Maker London
Lilly Purle Saughter S 20 Machinist (Shirt) London
Peter Purle Son S 17 Smith (Blacks) London
Joseph Purle Son S 15 Errand Boy (Port) London
Caroline Purle Daughter S 9 London
Mary Knight Drand-daughter S 4 London
Jane Foord Mother-in-Law W 78 London
Charles Frater Nephew - 18 London
1901 Census
RG 13/251 Page 4
Ecclesiastical St Silas
Municipal Finsbury
Ward No 1 (Pentonville)
Parliamentary Islington South
64 Wynford Road, Clerkenwell
Frederick Purle Head M 56 Bowyer (Toy) London
Caroline Purle Wife M 50 London
Willie Purle Son M 22 Cabinet Maker London
Lilly Purle Saughter S 20 Machinist (Shirt) London
Peter Purle Son S 17 Smith (Blacks) London
Joseph Purle Son S 15 Errand Boy (Port) London
Caroline Purle Daughter S 9 London
Mary Knight Drand-daughter S 4 London
Jane Foord Mother-in-Law W 78 London
Charles Frater Nephew - 18 London
1881 census
29 Henry Street, Neath, Glamorgan, Wales
PRO Ref: RG11 5340/66 43
Name Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
Arthur WINCHCOMBE Head M Male 25 Swansea, Glamorgan, Wales Accountant
Sophia WINCHCOMBE Wife M Female 21 Neath, Glamorgan, Wales Accountants Wife
William Herbert WINCHCOMBE Son Male 2 Neath, Glamorgan, Wales Accountants Son
Marriage for Hannah Sophia
Marriages Mar 1878
Bartlett Hannah Sophia Cardiff 11a 265 Scan available - click to view
possible husbands are
THOMAS Charles Hayward Cardiff 11a 265
Winchcombe Arthur Cardiff 11a 2651861 Glamorgan census
4085 065B 086 HENRY ST.20 BARTLET JOHN HD M 32 GARDENER GLS PRESTBURY 4085 065B 086 HENRY ST.20 BARTLET ELIZABETH WI M 29 - GLA NEATH 4085 065B 086 HENRY ST.20 BARTLET MARY ANN DA U 6 SCHOLAR GLA NEATH 4085 065B 086 HENRY ST.20 BARTLET MARY E. DA U 4 SCHOLAR GLA NEATH 4085 065B 086 HENRY ST.20 BARTLET HANNAH S. DA U 7M - GLA NEATH 4085 065B 086 HENRY ST.20 BARTLET MARY A. VR U 20 - GLS PRESTBURY 4085 065B 086 HENRY ST.20 BARTLET HANNAH S. VR U 17 - GLS PRESTBURY
Extracted from the Parish Register Indexes for St. Thomas - Neath as published by the GFHS.
Margaret Ann BARTLETT Dau of John ( a Gardener ) and Elizabeth baptised 22/10/1854 Other children of the same parents:
Hannah Sophia (20/4/1863);
Letucia Jane (20/4/1863);
Mary Elizabeth (20/4/1863); Alice ( 3/7/1876);
Gertrude ( 7/2/1871);
Iestin Hopkin ( 13/4/1868); Louisa ( 15/4/1867); The family is shown as being of Neath in most cases but for the baptism of Alice an address of 8 Henry St. is given. The burial indexes give a John as being buried 24/9/1880 aged 56 but there is no Elizabeth shown. After about 1850 there were no "new" graves opened in Neath Churchyard and although burials may be shown in the Neath- St. Thomas P R the actual burial place may be in Llantwit Churchyard.1881 census
29 Henry Street, Neath, Glamorgan, Wales
PRO Ref: RG11 5340/66 43
Name Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
Arthur WINCHCOMBE Head M Male 25 Swansea, Glamorgan, Wales Accountant
Sophia WINCHCOMBE Wife M Female 21 Neath, Glamorgan, Wales Accountants Wife
William Herbert WINCHCOMBE Son Male 2 Neath, Glamorgan, Wales Accountants Son
1881 census
29 Henry Street, Neath, Glamorgan, Wales
PRO Ref: RG11 5340/66 43
Name Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
Arthur WINCHCOMBE Head M Male 25 Swansea, Glamorgan, Wales Accountant
Sophia WINCHCOMBE Wife M Female 21 Neath, Glamorgan, Wales Accountants Wife
William Herbert WINCHCOMBE Son Male 2 Neath, Glamorgan, Wales Accountants Son
Name taken from marriage certificate. It shows his profession as "Mason" but this was the profession listed for Oliver FRATER which is known to be untrue.
Name taken from IGI Internet. This is disproved at this point
Surname also taken from IGI as the only marriage of John WELCH to a Sarah that matches in date terms to Sarah Ann & Eliza Mary
email from Virginia Stokes 28/12/2004
provided middle name
Alfred had a tinning business in Birmingham and acted in and produced amateur theatrical shows. He went to Belgium with one of his shows and fell off his bicycle while riding a tight rope. He married Agnes Emily White and had 9 children. He died in 1911 aged 65.1851 census
Not far away lived Thomas SHORT at 44, Sheep St. (Ref: 2054/183/21)
44, Sheep St. (near Gosta Green)
Head, Thomas SHORT, aged 25 Iron Castor, born Birmingham, Warwickshire
Wife, Emily, aged 26, born Warwickshire, Birmingham.
Son, Alfred, aged 5, born Warwickshire, Birmingham
Daughter, Emily, aged 3, born Warwickshire, Birmingham
Son Thomas, aged 1, born Warwickshire, Birmingham
(Thomas and Emily seem to have got married about 1845 or 46).email Mike Short 8.4.2006 orig research Virginia STOKES, and others
1861 Cen. living 70 Legge Street, Aston, Birmingham with parents1871 Cen. Living Front House, Allesley Street with wife and children Harry J & Francis Thomas (Frank). Occupation: Tinner
KF's 1881 census details
1881 census
89 Clifton Rd, Aston, Warwick, England
PRO Ref RG11 Piece/Folio 3043/81 Page 10
Name Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
Alfred SHORT Head M Male 35 B'Ham, Warwick, England Tinner
Agnes SHORT Wife M Female 34 Gloucester, Gloucester, England
Harry SHORT Son Male 12 Aston, Warwick, England Scholar
Frank SHORT Son Male 10 B'Ham, Warwick, England Scholar
Ada SHORT Daur Female 8 Aston, Warwick, England Scholar
Lillian SHORT Daur Female 6 Aston, Warwick, England Scholar
Clara SHORT Daur Female 3 Aston, Warwick, England
Agnes SHORT Daur Female 1 Aston, Warwick, England1891 Cen. Living Upper Sutton St, Aston Manor with wife; children Harry J - tinner, Francis Thomas (Frank) - Tinner, Ada Emily - Warehouse girl, Lilian Harriet - Silver Burnisher, Clara Margaret, Agnes ?Florence?, Alfred Dudley & Elsie May
1901 Cen. Living 119 Leonard Road, Handsworth with wife; children Alfred Dudley - Solicitor’s clerk, Elsie May - Clerk ….., & Constance Mary
email from Virginia Stokes 28/12/2004
He married Agnes Emily White and had 9 children.email from Mike Short 8.4.2006
1871 Cen. Living Front House, Allesley Street with husband and children Harry J & Francis Thomas (Frank). Husband’s ccupation: TinnerKF 1881 census
89 Clifton Rd, Aston, Warwick, England
PRO Ref RG11 Piece/Folio 3043/81 Page 10
Name Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
Alfred SHORT Head M Male 35 B'Ham, Warwick, England Tinner
Agnes SHORT Wife M Female 34 Gloucester, Gloucester, England
Harry SHORT Son Male 12 Aston, Warwick, England Scholar
Frank SHORT Son Male 10 B'Ham, Warwick, England Scholar
Ada SHORT Daur Female 8 Aston, Warwick, England Scholar
Lillian SHORT Daur Female 6 Aston, Warwick, England Scholar
Clara SHORT Daur Female 3 Aston, Warwick, England
Agnes SHORT Daur Female 1 Aston, Warwick, Englandemail from Mike Short 8.4.2006
1891 Cen. Living Upper Sutton St, Aston Manor with husband - self-employed tinner & founder; children Harry J - tinner, Francis Thomas (Frank) - Tinner, Ada Emily - Warehouse girl, Lilian Harriet - Silver Burnisher, Clara Margaret, Agnes Florence, Alfred Dudley & Elsie May
1901 Cen. Living 119 Leonard Road, Handsworth with husband; children Alfred Dudley - Solicitor’s clerk, Elsie May - Clerk ….., & Constance Mary
10 May 1911 death of Alfred Joseph bur. Handsworth New Cemy
email from Virginia Stokes 28/12/2004
provided name, year of death and age.
email from Virginia Stokes 30/12/2004
gave married name of Elsie Mayemail from Mike Short 8.4.2006
1891 Cen. Living Upper Sutton St, Aston Manor with parents.
1901 Cen. Living 119 Leonard Road, Handsworth with parents.
Children: Living children -information withheldFrom Virginia STOKES: Lillian, Elsie's sister used to say that Elsie was different from the other children. She put it down to the French connection. Elsie's gggrandmother on her mother's side was French and used to go dancing when in her 90s. Elsie proved them right she outlived her siblings by many years. Just before the Great Depression Elsie's husband left for Canada and never returned. The family was quite poor as a result and Elsie sublet rooms and did dress making to support the family. In 1932 Elsie was accidentally shot by a .22 or pea rifle at a fun fair. She was taken to hospital to have the bullet removed from her thigh. It just missed her 3 year old son's head.